Curse

Terra Xin · May 08, 2006, 02:20 PM // 14:20

OK then... *yawn* im so tired. I think I've spent more time on these forums in the past few days than I have in Factions :P.

The only whiners that really annoy me are the ones that repeat the same thing over and over...(need to learn to buggery read other threads) those are the whiners that are somehow leading to an anti-whiner movement group that supports Anet unconditionally. Other whiners I dislike are ones that complain about a problem, discuss the future downfall of Anet, and then a whole herd of sheep come in and take it out of proportion. The last group of bad whiners, complain about the desertion of areas, by which the logical answer is (and has been repeated many times... once again - ) wait a while for people to get there first.

On the flipside, the real whiners (sorry, cant find a more sutable word, but I dont mean it as an offense^^), the ones who have closely analised the game and compared it to it's elder game of prophecies, those are the whiners that Anet should be listening to.

This group is very important for iunfluencing change, without it, Anet effectively loses people, because the errors arent being recognised, people see them, deter themselves away from them (seeing as they don't/can't complain) and quite possibly leave the game altogether. Don't be shocked to find that it was whiners who held great influence to some of the really cool features that have arised in Factions^^. They state errors in quests, faults in NPC characters and Henchman, spelling mistakes, re-development of existing features, etc.

And of course, the reason why they aren't as effective as the ought to be, you have another group, the anti-whiners group I mentioned before, saying "quit your whining".

Note: whining against whiners, is whining.

Anet already knows thay've made a good game, so anyone posting a thread of congratulations isn't going to help them develop the game... except... perhaps to provide a 2% morale boost. I am sure if Anet wants to keep their popular fan base, they'll read the highlited threads by the moderators, or threads that have a large interest, and they will work on it.... hopefully.

To the poster from before, if you don't know what people are complaining about.... just a simple cure... read!

Concepts of Chapter 3? same as what influenced chapter 2... whiners^^.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jetdoc

It's like complaining that your free pizza is cold.

Think of it more like buying a pizza, and getting it cold, I think that applies to Factions.

Don Zardeone · May 08, 2006, 02:23 PM // 14:23

Oh, people can come up with statistics to prove anything, Kurt. 14% of people know that.

**cosyfiep** · May 08, 2006, 02:55 PM // 14:55

2 things........

Firstly, I think that a lot of the most recent faction bashing is due to the distrubition of CE....lots of people (me included) complained A LOT about it on many different threads. This would probably up the number of unhappy people threads.

Secondly, since I have not HAD my copy of factions to play I have spent most of the last week on this forum.....my join date is when I encountered a problem that guildwiki was unable to resolve and I had to seek alternate sources of information....so many people may not even be aware of this site, meaning that a great many guildwars players maynot even know about forums or such to contribute to/complain on. I believe those who post are a very small part of the gw community.

My two points. (and my CE is set to arrive today--1 day ahead of the ups set delivery date

but must go to work now

)

Ellipson · May 08, 2006, 03:31 PM // 15:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terra Xin

Anet already knows thay've made a good game, so anyone posting a thread of congratulations isn't going to help them develop the game... except... perhaps to provide a 2% morale boost. I am sure if Anet wants to keep their popular fan base, they'll read the highlited threads by the moderators, or threads that have a large interest, and they will work on it.... hopefully.

That 2% morale boost may be just what they need to kill the development boss "Togo the Snared" and cap "Remove Bugs."

On a more serious note, the only issue I've had so far are the bugs with some of the missions (like the oh-so-carefully referenced one above). TBH, I expected some of these kind of bugs, because they happen with every new release. Please don't speak for "all vets."

CKaz · May 08, 2006, 04:43 PM // 16:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by FoxBat

People have a baseline and certain expectations from Prophecies now. They have an idea about what to expect based on what they've seen before. Obviously then, when there are some areas that the new falls short of the old, they are easy to identify and complain about. Some unpopular changes:

1) Buginess of many factions missions/quests after these have been mostly patched in prophecies for a while.
2) Ultra-long fedex quests in the city, which are extremely rare in prophecies.
3) Realm of God's Favor system reincarnated into an even more elitist system, Elite missions. The elite tend to like them, but naturally they are the minority.
4) Factions is just plain not worth the same $50 as prophecies was to a veteran, its shorter, and you only get 2 new character classes and not nearly enough new skills on the other. Not that this necessarily matters or it should matter given their business model, but it's hard to argue you get less value for your buck here.

and I'm sure there's much more that could be added to the list... but basically, comparing factions to prophecies makes it pretty easy to identify tangible things "worth" complaining about. You've got your work more cut out for you when trying to find the flaws in something that cannot be compared more easily, as was prophecies' release.

Does this mean more people are actually unhappy? Maybe... people went into prophecies with vauger expecations before, now they are more concrete going into factions. It could be just as good as proph and that would still disappoint people because they've seen it before, so they complain or else leave...

Quoted for truth, loss of 2 slots and storage to boot for vets on link, while '100%' is not true either, there are a lot of restrictions Cantha/Tyrian. I thought 100% meant I could have a Ritualist work up the ranks with my wife's character post pre-sear in Ascalon. Nope, mission(s) denied. Similiarly Tyrians doing early Cantha. Co-op missions oddly enough deny cooperative opportunities, my Tyrian warrior couldnt help Canthan guild members fight in VSquare - they have a 'local' mission, I a 'foreign' one.

Elite missions wont play out at all well (trust us... indeed) and they even goof up IMO the easy stuff (12v12 alliance battles where you cant talk to your allied groups... uh huh). Bugs have been bad and connectivity horrible.

They come up with some interesting art and stuff to try but execution this round has been abysmal. Alliances not working at release - they work now? I know some guilds still havent 'lost enough opposing faction' to pick a side from what they gained in the FPE. Fun stuff.

So I'm enjoying what I can for this chapter, but I need to see problems ironed out, some help on storage, something done about auction/trade system, and just some smart moves to remotely consider a chapter 3 they'll want to try and push on me come the holidays. [After considering a $20 buyback for 2 character slots and meanwhile giving those CErs who coughed up an extra $20 an easy 500K+ in game if they wish to trade the dragon.]

/shrug

felinette · May 08, 2006, 04:54 PM // 16:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rayea

personally, i like small simple fed-ex over long ones here you have to kill lots of monsters, but thats a persona opininon.

I don't mind simple fedex quests; in fact, I prefer quests that only take 10-15 minutes over those that take an hour because then I can fit a quest in before I go to work or when I only have a half hour to play.

What I can't stand is quests that make me fight through an area I've just cleared. The zone to A, then back to B, then back to A problem, and too many quests in Factions are like that. I'd prefer zone to A, zone to B, then zone to C. There's nothing more discouraging than fighting your way through mobs for twenty minutes, reaching the next NPC, and having him tell you that to get to your next goal, you have to rezone and fight through the same mobs you just fought through. That's not fun at all.

One of my characters has reached the point where she has to acquire 10,000 faction for either the Luxons or Kurzick. I hardly played her over the weekend because the first few faction quests were like the ones I've described, and I just couldn't face doing more. I've already decided that I'm taking one of my characters over to Tyria right away and not bothering with the Canthan stuff until later. Canthan PvE gets boring in a hurry. I loved the starter island--thought it was really well done. The outdoor areas are beautiful everywhere. But PvE boils down to just throwing mob after mob after mob at you, IMO, and it's made more frustrating and tedious by patrols that cross each other and enemies that appear out of nowhere, making it very difficult to control aggro no matter how you try. Someone said there's a fine line between challenging and just plain frustrating/tedious/just not fun, and too much of Factions falls into the latter category for me. YMMV.

Fred Kiwi · May 08, 2006, 04:54 PM // 16:54

I think it would be a better representation of the figures if you counted each individual post

Loviatar · May 08, 2006, 05:06 PM // 17:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fred Kiwi

I think it would be a better representation of the figures if you counted each individual post

and also how many times they posted on each and every complaint thread.

and if they couldnt find one they start one.

a very small very vocal minority

TheCrusader · May 08, 2006, 05:08 PM // 17:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sirus Dibley

Rubbish. Most vets think it sucks. Sadly we have a lot of noobs on this forums who think they are "vets".

What do YOU classify as a "vet?" Is it someone who has been playing cein release? Someone who has been in the top teams for HA/GvG? Well, If thats what you classify it as, I consider myself a "vet."

My opinion on factions is that I am LOVING it, the PvE is 100x better than Prophecies, the missions/quests are more challenging, AND the PvP is better as well(cept Dual Smite, grrrr). Anyways, GJ Anet.

Navaros · May 08, 2006, 05:10 PM // 17:10

Veteran players have been playing the same 9 Tombs maps ad infinitum since Guild Wars came out. We're talking hundreds and hundreds if not thousands and thousands of times on the same 9 maps.

Instead of adding new maps, arenas, and content for Chapter 2: Anet instead just copy and pasted Chapter 1's PVP content into Chapter 2.

So of course most veterans are going to get bored with that. You can only replay the same 9 maps so many thousands of times before they grow stale.

Tijger · May 08, 2006, 05:18 PM // 17:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by KurtTheBehemoth

I was just stating the statistics in this thread. I could be wrong. Just do what I did and you will see how many ppl are upset.

So, on the basis of whining users on a forum a game is declared a hit or a miss now?

EVERY change to GW so far has resulted in tons of complaints and they ALWAYS outnumber the praise by at least 5-1.
Take a look how much complaining there was over Sorrow's Furnace, chests, the various skill rebalances, the whining over farming & running etc etc.

Just because you read on the Internet doesnt make it true, everyone I know in GW loves Factions and my wife and myself are enjoying GW more then ever before.

MSecorsky · May 08, 2006, 05:19 PM // 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Navaros

Veteran players have been playing the same 9 Tombs maps ad infinitum since Guild Wars came out. We're talking hundreds and hundreds if not thousands and thousands of times on the same 9 maps.

Instead of adding new maps, arenas, and content for Chapter 2: Anet instead just copy and pasted Chapter 1's PVP content into Chapter 2.

So of course most veterans are going to get bored with that. You can only replay the same 9 maps so many thousands of times before they grow stale.

So you're talking about Tombs PvP vets, not all vets. I've been PvE playing for about a year and feel I qualify, at least in part, as a vet in the PvE world. distinctions need to be made, imo.

Navaros · May 08, 2006, 05:21 PM // 17:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

So you're talking about Tombs PvP vets, not all vets. I've been PvE playing for about a year and feel I qualify, at least in part, as a vet in the PvE world. distinctions need to be made, imo.

I agree, although the title of this thread is vague so it seems fitting to answer both ways.

I think most of us who are honest with ourselves can agree that Factions skimped on both PVE and PVP content.

sh4ft3d · May 08, 2006, 05:33 PM // 17:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Zardeone

Oh, people can come up with statistics to prove anything, Kurt. 14% of people know that.

QFT. Surprised nobody else saw this and commented on it. Whatever you're personal opinion is, you can't really know whether or not other people hate/like Factions. I'm thinking of starting a thread (which will probably get closed by mods due to the high-probability of flaing) to settle once and for all how GwG users feel about Factions itself. Not the changes to the MM, or anything like that. Just Factions. A poll would make it final.

MSecorsky · May 08, 2006, 05:35 PM // 17:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Navaros

I agree, although the title of this thread is vague so it seems fitting to answer both ways.

I think most of us who are honest with ourselves can agree that Factions skimped on both PVE and PVP content.

I can't say that as of yet on the PvE side... I started my assassin during the 24 hour early launch and just now got him to Cavalon. That's playing every day and doing quests like crazy. I still haven't gotten all the quests done, but with they had a title for that... still, I've found PvE to be very very full so far, and now I've stepped back into daylight!

And have a whole new battery of quests to do at Cavalon.

Eet GnomeSmasher · May 08, 2006, 06:43 PM // 18:43

Both sides are idiots for claiming that "vets" love/hate the game. How the hell would you know either way? How could you possibly know what all or even most of the vets like unless you know them personally or some sort of GW wide poll was conducted? How would you know that someone was a vet unless you could tell how long they've been playing GW?

Making claims on either side of this issue about what vets like/hate is idiotic.

Loviatar · May 08, 2006, 07:45 PM // 19:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eet GnomeSmasher

Making claims on either side of this issue about what vets like/hate is idiotic.

/QFT as almost all vets are playing the game not bitching on a board

Eviance · May 08, 2006, 07:50 PM // 19:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iskrah

I had high expectations, and even if I'm playing it and enjoying some of it, I'm disapointed. Good chance I'll be smart enough to spend my 50 bucks on other end-of-the-year game next time. Factions feels too much like a 19$ add-on. A good one at that, sure.
The only way I buy Ch.3 is if PvE isn't all about FedEx, ANet stops encouraging elitism and most importantly, if new skills are important for PvP. Meh. :/

Pretty much the same here - I think you summed that up for me pretty nicely, thanks.

MelechRic · May 08, 2006, 08:31 PM // 20:31

^^ I agree with Iskrah's comment too. However, the new skills haven't had enough time to affect PvP. There's going to be some settling out before people decide which skills are PvP worth. Plus we have two new classes so that's another variable.

Personally, I've been using two new necro skills in PvP with great effect. I just need to sit down and work out how I might use more of the new Factions skills. I

TheShadowedBlade · May 08, 2006, 08:35 PM // 20:35

People dislike change.